School me on the w204

"mkbruin, Atlas VP" (mkbruin) 01/31/2018 at 22:26 • Filed to: None

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Everyone talks about the e90, but nobody ever talks about the w204. How is the cost of ownership for a c300 or c350? Common issues? Anything to watch out for?

Spanfeller is a twat > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/31/2018 at 22:34

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having driven a 328i, a 325d, and a C350 I think that the e9x is the faster, more enjoyable driver’s car. But that merc is very comfortable.

Did the merc have better brakes? I think so...

AM3R, lost another burner > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/31/2018 at 22:42

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I have a W204 c300 and 2 E9x’s (335i 6MT coupe and an auto 328i sedan). I prefer the E9x’s a lot more. Ask any specifics if you’d like. It’s a fully loaded W204 4matic with the auto.

BlueMazda2 - Blesses the rains down in Africa, Purveyor of BMW Individual Arctic Metallic, Merci Twingo > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/31/2018 at 22:44

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Common issues?

It’s not an E90.

No roundel or kidney grilles.

No M model or M-Sport packages.

Not available in Arctic Metallic.

E90M3 > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/31/2018 at 22:44

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I’ve test driven a couple. They drive nice, but didn’t meet what I was looking for. I prefer the sportier ride of the BMWs; I drove the luxury trim ones because I would want a hood ornament if I got one. I’ve heard the interiors in the pre-facelift cars were garbage; I drove a 2009 C63 AMG and the the interior was in pretty poor condition. For example I went to adjust the AC vent and it almost came out of the dash. Didn’t really matter, I still wanted it.

E90M3 > AM3R, lost another burner 01/31/2018 at 22:45

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Two E9Xs. Why would you need two of the same car?

E90M3 > BlueMazda2 - Blesses the rains down in Africa, Purveyor of BMW Individual Arctic Metallic, Merci Twingo 01/31/2018 at 22:51

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Ironically, you could not get an M-Sport E9X painted in Arctic Metallic. The M-Sport pack wasn’t available until the E90 got the LCI for the 2009 MY. Arctic Metallic was only available until the 2008 MY.

His Stigness > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/31/2018 at 22:53

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The interior doesn’t hold up nearly as well as an E90. But, having said that, I don’t think an E90 is stellar if you actually use it. But I’m never comfortable in W204's, whereas I usually am in an E90.

The W204 also isn’t very far removed from DaimlerChrysler, and the W203 was utter and complete shit. I’d say look at the W205.

I can’t speak to the common mechanical issues with the 204, though. You might want to ask AMGtech, or check the forums. But in terms of smog and passing smog, I really don’t see many 204's, but I see E90's for days.

BlueMazda2 - Blesses the rains down in Africa, Purveyor of BMW Individual Arctic Metallic, Merci Twingo > E90M3 01/31/2018 at 22:54

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My dream E90 is a base 2006 325i in Arctic Metallic with black leatherette, 6 speed steptronic, split folding seats, and the Harman Kardon.

Gib pls.

If it’s an M Sport, Le Mans Blue or Jet Black pls.

E90M3 > BlueMazda2 - Blesses the rains down in Africa, Purveyor of BMW Individual Arctic Metallic, Merci Twingo 01/31/2018 at 22:57

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I recently learned that the auto transmission was a cost option on the pre-LCI E90s. That made me happy. Sadly, they increased the base MSRP on the LCI E90s and made the auto a no cost option. Any reason you would rather have the auto?

I’ve got the black Sensatec in my 328i, I quite like it.

E90M3 > His Stigness 01/31/2018 at 22:59

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All the E9X steering wheels seem to do this. It seems like some of the buttons don’t wear that well. Fortunately, both of my interiors have held up really well.

BlueMazda2 - Blesses the rains down in Africa, Purveyor of BMW Individual Arctic Metallic, Merci Twingo > E90M3 01/31/2018 at 23:00

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I’m going to say it and get banned in the process.

I prefer automatics.

I can drive manuals well, but I don’t really find any enjoyment in it. I’ve driven some good manuals too, but I just don’t see the whole deal.

Also, yeah. I remember those days. Back when Crimson Red, Barbera Red, and Barrique Red were a thing.

E90M3 > BlueMazda2 - Blesses the rains down in Africa, Purveyor of BMW Individual Arctic Metallic, Merci Twingo 01/31/2018 at 23:04

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Maybe I can’t say why I prefer the stick but I will say I had an auto in my 128i and it just felt boring to me. When I had the 128i and the M3, I would always take the M3, unless I was going to work. Now that I have the 328i and the M3, it’s not a forgone conclusion I’m taking the M3. Sometimes I take the 3, this almost never happened with the 1.

phenotyp > E90M3 01/31/2018 at 23:09

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I think all 2000s-era BMWs have that issue. Both of my E60s did, to varying degrees.

E90M3 > phenotyp 01/31/2018 at 23:10

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I haven’t had any experience with the E60, but I would assume it’s a common thing on BMWs of this era.

fintail > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/31/2018 at 23:11

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Much more mature than the BMW equivalent, in many ways. They have turn signals and can move away from a green light at under 3000 rpm. Significant facelift inside and out for MY 2012 (pictured car is pre-facelift). They exist with manuals. Not sure about running costs, but I haven’t heard horror stories about any particular model. I’d go with the nicest and newest one you can afford - the bargain game cam be dangerous with these cars.

sony1492 > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/31/2018 at 23:32

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I’ve been reading up on them and theres a couple alarming reliability things ive found. The Electronic steering lock can/does fail randomly meaning your car won’t start. It requires removing the steering wheel and dropping the steering column if I’m not mistaken.(A pita to do due to other factors aswell) And the part needs to be coded to the vehicle, so when it does fail it will have to be bought and replaced by Mercedes or an Indy shop with very good equipment. Look up EIS and ESL issues for more/better information.

I’m doing some searching for what car I’ll eventually want to finance and it’s stuff like that that’s pushing me from the mercedes over to other cars. But on the other hand the c class of that era is devaluing quite well and is very handsome. It looks like one of those cars that you buy an extended warranty for.(I’ve read it being $3k for 2 years unlimited miles)

sony1492 > AM3R, lost another burner 01/31/2018 at 23:35

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Have you had esl or eis problems?

AM3R, lost another burner > sony1492 01/31/2018 at 23:52

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I have not. The only notable issues I’ve had was a water leak from the pano roof, which was solved by cleaning all the drains for the car out. While the leak was happening, I had a transmission issue where the car would shift into drive or reverse, but nothing would happen. It wasn’t all the time, and once I cleared the drains and dried up all the water, the problem disappeared, so I’m assuming water was just somewhere it shouldn’t have been.

I bought it when it had around 50k miles on it in early 2015. I bought it from a shady used lot (it was a great price and the only red, fully loaded model I could find) and it was a one owner car. Not the cleanest cosmetically, but it’s been decently solid so far. About to cross 100k.

AM3R, lost another burner > E90M3 01/31/2018 at 23:53

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The 328i was too reliable for me, had to test my fate with the 335i.

His Stigness > E90M3 01/31/2018 at 23:58

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I see that occasionally. The thing I see most of the time are worn down buttons. I don’t why people keep hitting the first radio preset, but they do. And they’re constantly turning down the AC.

But I think the E90 doesn’t rattle nearly as much as 204 might. Like I told Atlas, the 204 is too close to DaimlerChrysler for my tastes.  

His Stigness > E90M3 01/31/2018 at 23:59

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Instead of another E90 why don’t you get an E60 M5? Then you can have a 6, 8 and 10 cylinder!

G_Body_Man: Sponsored by the number 3 > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/31/2018 at 23:59

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The post-facelift ones are nice and the C350s make a surprisingly decent noise, but they’re not E90s. If you want ballistic acceleration and an engine note that’s better than most handjobs, check out the C63. If you want to flex for the ‘gram and/or drop the top, check out an E-class cabriolet. If you just want something more reliable than an E90 and are willing to give up a clutch pedal, check out a Lexus IS350. If you want boosted goodness and no ragrets, check out a 335i.

hike > E90M3 02/01/2018 at 01:08

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I’ve seen a lot of W204s do the same thing. My dad had a C250 for a few years and had his steering wheel replaced under warranty.

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > sony1492 02/01/2018 at 01:27

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That’s only up to about 2010. After that they’re fine.

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > sony1492 02/01/2018 at 01:29

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That’s only up to about 2010.

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > mkbruin, Atlas VP 02/01/2018 at 01:37

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Common issues? Earlier than 2010 the interior might be crap, especially if it was owned by someone who didn’t care. Same time period has shit steering locks that would cause a no start. 4matic ones from then had leaky transfer cases, but those have mostly been sorted. C250's are by far the least reliable.

2012 and newer 300/350 though? Umm... I have had to do some suspension repairs to them, after people drive them over curbs when it’s icy. That’s about it. Seriously. 2012 saw a massive interior facelift, minor exterior facelift, and new engine. It’s so much better it feels like an entirely different car. I think they drive quite nicely, but apparently not everyone agrees.

sony1492 > AMGtech - now with more recalls! 02/01/2018 at 07:31

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Well that’s awesome

Party-vi > BlueMazda2 - Blesses the rains down in Africa, Purveyor of BMW Individual Arctic Metallic, Merci Twingo 02/01/2018 at 09:35

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Party-vi > AMGtech - now with more recalls! 02/01/2018 at 09:36

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C350s are coming down to the low-$20Ks, and my wife has already put it on her “no” list since “it’s a Mercedes”. Who would have guessed maintenance on a 200K mile BMW would leave a bad taste in her mouth?

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > Party-vi 02/01/2018 at 10:07

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Lol but all German cars are the same!!!

Party-vi > AMGtech - now with more recalls! 02/01/2018 at 10:10

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Edmunds showing the 5-year cost of ownership at $20K more than a GTI or Mazda 6 didn’t help, although their maintenance of $2,000 a year is pretty damn suspect.

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > Party-vi 02/01/2018 at 10:24

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Extremely suspect, especially for 2012 or newer. Worst case before that, maybe. Or for a C63, sure. Actually, if they’re counting all years on all trim levels including C63, yeah.

Believe it or not I actually really like working on newer 204's. They’re a nice break from high dollar quotes. Most of the time they only need a couple maintenance items, brakes or tires. Even higher mileage ones. Often even if previous maintenance has been lacking. Actually the same goes for 212's.

E90M3 > hike 02/01/2018 at 10:59

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Wonder if they used the same supplier.

E90M3 > His Stigness 02/01/2018 at 11:00

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I wish. I don’t think I have money to maintain that V10.

E90M3 > AM3R, lost another burner 02/01/2018 at 11:02

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It was sort of a joke, because I also have two E9Xs.

E90M3 > His Stigness 02/01/2018 at 11:03

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Yeah, I’m not really sure. Either they made poorly or people rub their hands across them or something. Not sure, but looking at them for sale and it’s always those buttons.

The interior of the M3 is immaculate, 3 also in pretty good condition.

His Stigness > E90M3 02/01/2018 at 11:16

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Is it really any different than the M3, though?

E90M3 > His Stigness 02/01/2018 at 11:59

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Not they’re both the same, I’m more talking about condition.

His Stigness > E90M3 02/01/2018 at 12:27

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Ah. Good point.

E90M3 > His Stigness 02/01/2018 at 12:28

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They do use some nicer materials in the M, but for the most part the buttons and things like that are the same.

AM3R, lost another burner > E90M3 02/01/2018 at 13:29

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Ah yes I know

His Stigness > E90M3 02/01/2018 at 14:00

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I agree. I think the steering wheel might be different, though. But you would know better than I; it’s been a long time since I’ve been in an E9x M3. Totally don’t regret getting pulled over in it, though.

E90M3 > His Stigness 02/01/2018 at 14:42

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The M3 has nicer leather and tri color stitching, but other than that it’s the same as the 3, save for the M button. All the buttons are in the same place though.

RT > mkbruin, Atlas VP 02/01/2018 at 15:02

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Because the last time Mercedes made a competitive 3-series rival, it was 1993.

And even then, everyone talks about the E30 and E36 more. 

sony1492 > AMGtech - now with more recalls! 02/01/2018 at 19:17

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So a prefacelift 2011 should be clear of that issue? Have you seen any issues with the manuals?

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > sony1492 02/01/2018 at 21:01

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Maybe. Honestly don’t remember the exact cutoff off the top of my head. Manuals have been good. That being said I’ve worked on more SLS’s than manual Mercedes. It’s also not a sporty transmission. At all. Not even a little bit.